I Know A Few Marines Too.
Writer and Army wife Kanani Fong provided us with her commentary on the recent controversy surrounding Deb Pauly’s remarks at a Yorba Linda protest:
One of the most disturbing inclusions in Villa Park Council Woman and OC Republican Committee Representative Deb Pauly’s careless remarks at the recent protest in Yorba Linda was that she “knew a few Marines who would….” Of course, the remainder of this threat was that she knew Marines who would act as her personal ruffians to send to a private, peaceful event and do some harm.
Her words are a gross distortion of and do great dishonor to not only The Marine Corps, but all those who serve. The image she invoked reinforces the stereotype of our armed forces as an unthinking, heartless and randomly violent Leviathan force. Nothing can be further from the truth, and it is regretful Pauly brandished this threat as though she were a drunk gunslinger in a lawless saloon.
The Marines do not work this way. Their missions are well planned, involve a great deal of intelligence gathering, planning, and consideration. Perhaps she would not have been so careless with words had she been following The Marines progress in Helmand province, Afghanistan. The fulfillment of their mission has been nothing less than exemplary, showing not only the propensity to live and work alongside them, learn their local language, make it possible for the local Islam girls to go to school, in addition to restoring a climate of entrepreneurship where the local bazaar is thriving again. I have personal knowledge of the efforts being made over there, as my own husband is an active duty soldier, who in the past provided healthcare to Afghan locals in another province, Kunar. This included taking care of many children who were burn victims, and others who had suffered serious injuries due to IEDs.
The fact of the matter is that The Marines along with the world’s armed forces are bringing the first glimmer of opportunity since the Russians killed an estimated four million Afghans, followed by the killing of 400,000 innocents during the Taliban regime.
I know a few Marines too, and none of them would do as Pauly insinuates. They are not thugs. They are professionals, and a great many have died in the line of duty to protect the locals from thugs who are hired by AlQaeda who come from all countries to work for peanuts for an ideology that results in the stripping away of human rights, torture, and death. Need anyone want a reminder, Dexter Filkins wrotes concisely about what the soccer stadium was used for in Kabul during the Taliban regime.
This is not to say that one does not question organizations such as CAIR. If one wants to look into the checkered past of CAIR, they will find plenty of past actions that run counter to peace. It’s also fair to ask this new offshoot of CAIR: Why didn’t they join up with local organizations that have been addressing homelessness and abuse decades? And of course, as I asked on my own military blog The Kitchen Dispatch, it is entirely fair to ask if they wanted to have a first event: Why invite two controversial and suspect individuals to an area known to be politically to the right?
I do think it is important to address extreme Islam, just as it is to question the actions of a few Christians carrying out extreme acts such as the Westboro church’s hateful protests against victims of AIDS and soldiers, and most recently Rev. Terry Jones’ burning of the Quran in Florida. To this, I would ask CAIR why they did not instead invite Dr. M. Zuhdi Jasser, founder of the American Islamic Forum For Democracy. Dr. Jasser is a former Navy Officer, who has gone on to speak out against radical Islam. These are the types of questions that are fair to put to the organizers of the event.
I am also perplexed why Ed Royce would decide to take his stand at this event. It would seem that while there are bonafide concerns about radical Islam, neither politician used common sense, or went about it in an intelligent way. Pauly’s remarks were self aggrandizing and akin to proving herself as “more a military supporter than others, and also more as a conservative Republican than others.” However, she has fallen short, has embarrassed herself and has greatly maligned the honor and professionalism of those who serve. Pauly seems to be a highly risky person for Republicans to include as it tries to remake itself into a timely and current political party.
I disagree with a few of her statements but Mrs. Fong is mostly correct and has explained a pragmatic approach to addressing radical Islam.
She offers more meaningful dialog than most. Thanks!!!
Kanani, Thank you 🙂 for taking the time to write this post for our humble blog and especially for raising questions (intelligent ones) on this very important subject. I believe it’s very, very important for people in the community to write/stand/speak up (courage) when our so called “leaders” are pandering and not leading.
Kanani for city council?
I totally agree with this post. I would submit that professionalism is the hallmark of the greater majority of military personnel.
Pauly should know this given that she touts her and her husband’s military service.
I could not disagree more. This whole situation is a trumped up sham as a result of a very well edited Hate Comes to OC video (which took 2 full weeks to sufficiently edit and post on YouTube) which falsely portrayed Pauley and Royce as being a part of the same event in which idiots are seem screaming at children from 50’ away. Not only is that not the case, but the orchestrators of the event that Pauley and Royce spoke at encouraged their supporters to stay away from the actual event which took place hours after their rally. Furthermore, while many posters on this blog get up in arms about children accessing porn or what have you on their school district issued laptops from their homes (as we should be concerned about that), it is ignored that the hosts of the so-called “CAIR” event had distributed flyers to local high schools on this event…an event which was keynoted by a speaker one can readily watch deliver hours of speeches on YouTube vehemently supporting what he terms “noble martyrs” in the form of suicide bombers. I’m not aware that charity events put on by peace loving organizations typically invite supporters of suicide bombing to speak.
As far as Ms. Fong’s assertion that Pauley does dishonor to the Marines with her comments, Pauley is well aware that one of the greatest continuing threats to our Marines in two theatres (which I wish we would leave) are the very suicide bombers which the keynote speaker of the event in question believes to be heroes. Ms. Fong’s interpretation of Pauley’s words as being a serious and specific threat of bringing her Marine friends to act as thugs is just silliness. I would also be willing to bet that the VAST majority of marines who have served recently in Iraq or Afghanistan would react positively to Pauley’s words. I do not believe they would be insulted. Having said that, I too believe that her choice or words was poor and unnecessarily provocative. Pauley should have more clearly apologized for those specific words as the resulting uproar was not entirely unpredictable…and did not serve her mission well.
My guess is that the vast majority of commenters did not listen to the entire speeches of either Royce or Pauley. At no time do they advocate for a reduction in civil rights or freedoms. They are merely exercising their freedom to point out that the organization in question has a demonstrable history of supporting those who encourage terrorism. I’m about as far from a theologian as one can get, but I do know this. Radical Islam exists and if, in fact, mainstream Islam is peaceful and not radical, they are doing precious little to reduce the justifiable concerns of peace loving American and Westerners about the impressive number of murders and acts of violence committed in the name of their faith both on our soil and around the world.
I want to be clear, the people screaming at and towards chidren in the Hate Comes to OC video or are behaving like asses. Those children are innocent and one must protect children. I think it’s also reasonable to say that the rally that Royce and Pauley spoke at would have been well-served to further consider the ramifications in advance. I also think that Pauley should have been far more clear in her specific apologies for the children that had to endure those rants. However, I would LOVE to see a debate between Pauley and any blogger on this site with regard to the state of radical Islam in America and the world. Deborah Pauley may be a lot of things, but stupid is not one of them.
Pauly said what she said. And what she said was freakin’ stoopid.
And I would like to some American politicians with some honesty and guts who quit putting a foreign nation’s interests ahead of their own.
That’s called TREASON.
Chris, Your commentary was extremly well done & articulated beautifully. In fact, before I read your reply, mine was going to be about the same.
I was at the rally also & I know the radicals all too well ( I walked through the North Tower W.T.C. (6) days a week for (3) years on my way to work on Wall St. & Broadway from N.J. in the mid 70’s) & I know that if Deborah didn’t use those words & dressed them up a little, they would have found another non issue to slam her with. Let’s face it, The strategy is simple, they must keep the focus & distractions any where but where it rightly should be, dealing with truth, the facts & the perils America is facing today. In football, it’s called, misdirection.
And by the way, we know how they feel about “Strong Woman!” It Gaulls them!!!
Thanks again Chris for a very well thought out &
impassioned overview of what really took place that historic day..
Mel B.
Typical. “I walked through the WTC…”
So effing what?
Gary Miller was there too.
Chris, in essentially the same breath, Pauly made two points. She…
1) Criticized the imams for advocating violence.
2) Advocated violence against the imams.
If that’s not stupid, what is?
Actually, Walker, you just stated exactly what should happen: violent rhetoric against violent rhetoric.
Just one small difference between Pauly and the Imams: the Imams support violence on ALL infidels where as Pauly suggests violence on ALL terrorists.
Interesting. What’s Pauly’s definition of terrorist? Certainly if the imams were guilty of terrorism they would be locked up in the US prison system rather than giving speeches in Yorba Linda.
Terrorism no longer requires definition. It’s more of a state of mind, and I know it when I see it.
Respectfully Mr. Walker, Texas Ranger. Not necessarily. You might remember back to the mid 1990’s a certain ex Football Player with the Initials O.J.S. if my memory serves me correctly, was found not guilty in a court of law for murdering two innocent people & was out & about playing Golf & signing Footballs for many years until he did something stupid as the radicals will do, as they’ve been doing, until the light bulb finally goes off & people say, “oh, that’s what all the hub bub was about. That’s what they were making such a big deal about.” Hmm.
Mel B.
Thanks for another non sequitur.
Actually, Mr. Walker, Texas Ranger, she criticized the imams for advocating violence against innocent people, and proceeded to advocate violence against terrorists who want to kill innocent people.
WTR, do you have the verbatim quote at your disposal? I’m interested, but I’m out at the amazing Fullerton State of the City addressaddress watching Admin video Dr. Jones.
“What’s going on over there right now … that is pure, unadulterated evil.”
“I know quite a few Marines who will be very happy to help these terrorists to an early meeting in paradise,”
This should be fun, boy oh boy I cant wait to see the video.
WTR, I didn’t realize that was the comment you were referring to. I disagree with your characterization of the comment. Pauley specified terrorists and I don’t agree that the comment was tantamount to specifically calling for violence against the Imams. She was just pointing out that our Marines are fully prepaired to fight. I think the comment was a mistake because it was unnecessarily provacative. Having said that, as with this post, she is frustrated that so many are not paying attention to what this organization supports. Pauley flat out did not call for violence.
Here’s the transcript. The context of “these people” who should be sent to an early meeting in paradise appears to be those meeting in Yorba Linda. She pointed to them a few sentences earlier. You can see it in the videos.
http://ca.cair.com/images/uploads/Pauly_Speech,_Feb._13_YL_Rally_.pdf
I can’t believe you just linked to a document on a terrorist website. Now you are a terrorist. I know somebody who will be happy help you to an early meeting in paradise.
I think we need to pick a new target and organize against that. If we continue to focus on Pauley or Muslims we take our eyes off the goal. Limited, Open Government.
I couldn’t disagree more. The anti-muslim fear mongering of the War on Terror Police State proponents is helping to kill limited, open government.
Just Sad, “The anti-muslim fear mongering of the War on Terror Police State proponents is helping to kill limited, open government.” You my friend just made the best and the most truthful comment of the day.
“If these people that are gathering right now as I’m speaking to you were the altruistic, peace-loving relief agency that this flyer claims them to be, they would be condemning these terrorist instigators and instead of inviting them to be their keynote speakers.”
“Those of you who are gathered here you know what’s going on but I want to tell you something, you are rare in America. Most
Americans have no idea what’s going on right now and part of the reason why we have been
quiet, those of us who know what’s going on have been cowed, cowed into silence out of fear.”
“And I’m telling you, we cannot afford to do that anymore. We have to go out and speak to our friends and our neighbors.
“We need to make sure everyone knows and I don’t even care. I don’t even care if you think I’m crazy anymore because I have, I have a beautiful daughter I have a wonderful 19-year old son who’s a United States Marine. As a matter of fact, I know quite a few Marines who will be very happy to help these terrorists to an early, uh, meeting in paradise.”
Deb Pauly’s words, directed at the (2) terrorist supporting speakers – NOT the attendees at the event – “.. instead of inviting them to be their keynote speakers.”
Now there’s a sentiment I can agree with. Pauly has derailed this train enough. Let’s move along.
deb pauley was a vocal shawn nelson supporter
So was Ed Royce. Maybe the two are involved in a conspiracy here. Look in to it and report back compton.
“The anti-muslim fear mongering of the War on Terror Police ..”
The is no anti-muslim fear mongering – period. There is anti-terrorist supporting sentiment.
compton said: “deb pauley was a vocal shawn nelson supporter”
So effin’ what compton? Shawn is opposed to terorism – me too.
I would like to reiterate that irrespective of Pauly’s remarks on terrorists (real or imagined), her real failing is the portrayal of the American military as bloodthirsty killers.
I’m not in the military any longer, but the concept of killing someone (even if they were the declared enemy of the US) was something I hoped to never have to do.
This whole episode gives Pauly way too much credit. From what I have seen, she is not particularly articulate, more of a rable rouser in a dress.
The scary part is the two sitting Congressmen who attended, are much the same.
Which brings up the point: These politicos will SAY and DO anything to get attention……………except of course, what they were elected to do: Govern.
I’m pretty sure Deborah Pauley wouldn’t lose too much sleep the night before debating you on this, or any other political topic Tony. She’s a pretty bright lady. She made a mistake with her choice of words, but you’d be guessing wrong if you guessed her to be dumb. I’d also be willing to give favorable odds to Ed Royce in a debate on this topic. Note what you’re going to be facing. Below is the sweetheart who Pauley and Royce wanted to make the community aware was coming to town.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7iUFtkTvyE
Hey Chris that guy doesn’t scare me. Why does he scare you?
Sometimes blogging is just very tedious.
I’d agree with you Chris, Deb Pauley isn’t gong anywhere, in fact I would be surprised to hear she is considering a run for the legislator or Supervisors office.
For shit. Pauley’s full quote was wayyyyyy more inflammatory than was quoted here. Pearrrrrrly gates? Probably saved this blog from being unplugged by the terrorists. Dig the context under which she spread her venom. No question she meant to seem officious with the cameras rolling. Those two guys may have some way bad tendencies but they were never charged. If there are problems with the lack of prosecution then bring that up in a different way. But pearly gates? Using the marines to flex a flabby muscle? Yeah, I agree with 4SD. She was wayyyy wrong in doing that to the Corps.
What’s so hil-ar-ious is seeing the bile form in Chip-on-his-shoulder Thompson so easily. Predictable even. Get red faced and pissed off, defend, without digesting the contents. He’s the FF bulemic.
Luckily, we have C-SPAN to watch Ed Royce demonstrate his oratory skills (or lack there of).
I am continually amazed at how easily as a society we say things like “she’s a pretty bright lady”.
As I suffer through the past council meetings where she has spoken I have yeat to find any “post high school level” demonstration of Debrah’s speaking skills or intelligence. Perhaps I am wrong.
My whole point was not to pit a Imam (in my opinion not any different from the Christan crazies we have in Southern California), but rather to say, this whole thing has turned into a political stunt.
If Debrah Pauley was any kind of leader, she would have stood up and defended her position explaining her objections, and maybe just maybe talk to some of those who were impacted by this.
I know that the writer at the Brea High School paper and the debate student at the new Yorba Linda High School did a much better job than the councilwoman did in addressing the situation.
As an education guy I am stunned you don’t see this as how FHS or Sunny Hills students (realizing it’s FJHSD, not yours), but just the same, I find your defense of her reasoning questionable.
The only issue I have with Deb Pauly is her apology.
The fact of the matter is that the United States is going to continue chasing its tail on the issue of dealing with Islam until we recognize exactly what we are dealing with and have leaders willing to stand and identify Islam as what it really is; a theopolitical belief system that has existed for 1400 years. Read the Koran, read the Surra and read the Hadis and realize that Islam, according to its own scriptures is NOT a religion of peace and that the terorrists killing in the name of their religion are NOT radicals but in fact true followers of Islam.
Councilwoman Pauly was as right as rain in identifying the Muslim speakers as the threat they are to our free Western Republic.
You are so full of crap it’s hard to know where to start addressing your comment. Islam was preserving “Western” culture when your ancestors were living in straw huts with their pigs.
The biggest threats to our “Western Republic” (whatever the hell that is) are an ever growing police state that wants to dictate every aspect of you life; and a persitant Christian “theopolitical” strain that craves to do the same.
Pull you head out Charles; see the light.
2009 Fullerton Tea Party was attended by close to ten thousand people whose focus was excessive taxation and government bloat especially under Gov. Schwarzenegger. On the fringes of this event were less than ten people who spouted racist comments and fewer than this number carried racist signs( I know because I was there) Yet, some radical left news media videotaped only these few people with their signs and chose only to interview them and their bizarre ramblings about being taken over and controlled by black people or “Mexicans”. From a norm sample of less than ten the radical left news media generalized that all tea partiers truly were racists. At the CAIR event discussed above, a few fringies who would gather at any event tp spew invectives are grafted onto the mainstream protest and its speakers Pauly and Royce to falsely accuse them of being hate-mongers.
As has been pointed out: she said what she said. And what she said was a death threat.
define death treat when put into the context of a war
threat not treat
“Context of war?” That’s just hilarious. That’s how big government robs you of your rights and your wealth: by declaring war. War on Drugs, War on Terror, War on This War on That.
How about we start putting our own country first? That will save everybody hundreds of billions of dollars.
It was not a death threat to any one except the terrorists in the middle east trying to kill US
Austin, walk down my neighborhood pointing guns at my family or my friends and I’d want to kill you too.
So Howard J., I assume you are in agreement with Ms. Pauly then, who merely wants to protect us against those who wish us harm?
the news media with its own agenda grafts fringe elements tot he mainstream to falsely accuse Pauly and Royce as hate-mongers
I’m not the news media. Pauly is not in the middle of any stream i want to swim in. She is a self-serving, undereducated wing nut. Think Palin with a blond wig.
“Think Palin with a blond wig.”, that’s funny and true.
Uneducated? I think not, she is one of the most intelligent people I have ever met. She might have made a poor choice of words a few times in her life, but so does everybody else. She speaks the truth and most people don’t want to hear it.
Uh huh. Sure. Whatever you say. Don’t meet a lot of people do you?
Have you met her? Probably not. I have met many people, several of which were Harvard Law graduates. Now keep in mind that she is not the most intelligent person I have ever met, but she is in the top 15
Kanani Fong writes” the image she invoked(Pauly) reinforces the stereotype of our armed forces as an unthinking, heartless and randomly violent Leviathan force.” My son was taught to chant “stomp, stomp, stomp dead Iraqi babies” in Marine boot camp. Uhh, maybe our armed forces do resemble more a violent Leviathan force than a social workers brigade. And that is why our foreign policy should never resort to military good will missions or “surgical strikes” unless it is determined by the president’s advisors that if we don’t inflict our lethal force direct harm will occur to Americans on US soil or abroad. the military should never be confused with good will ambassadors
Why did Royce show up? Clearly it is Napoleon Complex and a need to bolster his campaign funds. The answer; act tough and suck up some pro Isreal money.
Austin said:
“It was not a death threat to any one except the terrorists in the middle east trying to kill US.”
Exactly !!
Wrong. It was a threat made against the two supposed terrorists speaking at the fundraiser. That’s whom she claimed she was addressing. Aren’t you paying attention?
So she made a terrorist threat right here in OC.
Have you actually seen the whole speech or have you just seen the 5:00 one distributed by CAIR
She said what she said.
She has not made a terrorist threat, she is referring to terrorists in general, not the two speakers in particular. She is saying that marines, one of which is her son, would have no problem killing terrorists who want AMERICA destroyed, every one of us dead.
And you want them all dead. You have found perfect playmates. Good luck with that.
The terrorists want to do to us and our country what Hitler and the nazi’s wanted to do to the Jews. If Mrs Pauly had been alive then and had said the same thing about nazi’s while protesting in front of an event that had speakers with nazi ties, I don’t think that there would be so much outlash.
That’s a really very ignorant statement.
Are you denying that terrorist want us dead? If you do, you are the ignorant one
Recourse to a NAZI analogy is very lame. But that’s what the Neocon liars want us to believe. Thta’s why they made up the term Islamo-fascism.
For someone so smart she sure sounds pretty goddam stupid.
I am still not getting why she is stupid, please explain.
She sure sounded stupid. Emotional references to her beautiful 19 year old daughter and blood-thirsty Marine son certainly don’t make for an informed argument. Nor does the statement “what’s going on over there (where would that be pray tell?) is pure evil.”
That’s just lamebrain rhetoric. If she believes it she’s stupid. If she doesn’t she’s a disingenuous rabble-rouser that sounds stupid.
Hey I know a Harvard Graduate with an English Major and he is pretty stupid. He runs a county agency and buys buildings that are good for notin.
Aristotle: “When a man uses profanity to support an argument, it indicates that either the man or the argument is weak – probably both”
“Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.”
Me.
I love being a scoundrel! 🙂
So you only know 15 people. I wouldn’t advertise it.
D Pauley is pretty smart she just doesn’t know how to take her foot out of her mouth.
Deborah Pauley interview with Larry Elder. She talks about her opinion on American Muslims, how her detractors dealt with the Yorba Linda council meeting and a variety of other things. Most comprehensive recording I’ve heard of her thoughts on all of this.
http://fetch.noxsolutions.com/elder/audio/DeborahPauly_032511.mp3