A Brief Respite
In a campaign that has been long on issues and short on joy, I thought it would be hopeful to post a couple of the sweetest images I have seen in this campaign.
Travis’ little girl, Selah, exalting in unbridled joy at the sight of her dada on a door hanger:
and Sean Paden’s beautiful daughter sitting next to her mommy and taking a picture of her daddy making a speech. Sean is a winner no matter what happens in this election.
Little Paden was so darn cute with a smile that goes on for miles. And I think you are right about Sean. Good person!
Yes very cute Greg. What’s your thought on the deceptive mailer you are included in from COPS?
Da Da
Awwww……wait…what??
http://copsvoterguide.com/guide/travis_kiger
“Appearance is paid for and authorized by each candidate”
How much did this cost Travis? Running for Orange City Council? You may want to ask for a refund, but thanks for supporting our police!
we gonna see
I just got this mailer today. Who are these guys? Obviously not affiliated with the FPOA.
A much needed and welcomed break. Thank you, Chris. Some are incapable of appreciating things like this. It must truly suck to be them.
The little ones are adorable!
They say that politics is dirty. That is only because very few GOOD people get involved. We can never have enough good candidates running for office. I hope Sean Paden sticks with it too.
Thank you for the kind words, it is much appreciated. And you’re right, Genevieve is a great kid and I’m definately a very lucky dad.
Also, I’d like to thank Greg and all the other candidates who introduced themselves to her at the NUFF meet and greet last Monday. She had a great time matching the candidates’ faces with the campaign signs she sees around town and It was a very classy move on everybody’s part.
Sean, your words and actions are promising. I believe you have a future helping your community on the road to recovery. Stay the course.
admin, I had no intention of having a link in my comment, if it’s not too much trouble, please remove the link in my above comment.
Thank You.
Cute, cute kids.
Could somebody tell me why the COPS website is supporting Travis Kiger???
I really need to know what’s going on there.
Thanks.
My guess is the COPS know a good candidate when they see one. Everyone benefits from a clean PD!
Did this same COPS website condemn the Kelly Thomas brutal beating and murder? If so, please point to the article. If not, why would the COPS who remain silent on the beating support Travis Kiger?? It just doesn’t make sense. I have no dog in the race. I just want to make sure that voters have access to all relevant information. Perhaps Travis could clear this up for us. Much appreciated.
Who are these “COPS” you speak of?? Any specific law enforcement entity identify itself with this org?
Lol, it’s just another sham org that dishonest politicians play with.
I’ve been meaning to say: that’s one of the funniest handles I’ve ever seen.
Is that really your guess? How darling!
http://www.orangejuiceblog.com/2012/05/the-cops-voter-guide-has-arrived-and-it-says-um-huh/
Oh look the man who can’t afford to buy a single slate mailer.
You mean the man who is opposed to buying endorsements from fake organizations that sell to the highest bidder. Easy mistake (for you) to make.
Well said, another reason to vote for Matt Rowe.
I agree JustUs with clarification about the COPS situation. And I find it interesting how the Harpoon likes to answer questions directed towards Travis.
Read the comment: Justus asks if “somebody” can tell him why the website is supporting Travis. I’m somebody and I offered a guess. Why is this interesting?
I find it interesting because this is a matter of: if the person running for a seat in our local govenrment can answer their own questions, and not be a “puppet” – so to speak. And if you read the second part to the post it is asking for Travis to clarify. I understand your willingness to promote Kiger, and yet when it boils down to an endorsement from law enforcement – we need to hear it straight from the horse’s mouth.
No that wasn’t a “second part of the post.” It was separate comment that was made after mine. I can read if you can’t.
If you are reading this from your phone it looks as such. JustUs replied to your initial response on the website. Yes, I can read, and please don’t question my intelligence. There is no reason to get snarky about this.
You might want to take at the choice of words that Travis made in his paid message to a voting propensity that is known to generally by heavily pro-law enforcement. It actually takes courage to send an accurate message to a group who might be less likely to want to hear it.
“Support our police with balanced budgets and pension reforms that do not burden future generations. Endorsed by Fullerton’s top reformers.”
Good police who are good people want good governance.
Well of course! We keep hearing about all the “good cops.” Good cops must want honest police departments, right? In Fullerton all the good cops are going to get one.
They’re going to get a good department whether they want one or not!
If you go to copsvoterguide.com and learn about the organization it will read in part:
“The candidates we support have pledged to make public safety a top priority and work with law enforcement to protect our safety. Thank you for your support!”
This sounds like a pro-law enforcement site that pushes people who are pro-cop.
Personally, I don’t think FPD is deserving of citizen support after the culture of corruption it has promoted. They have to clean the crap from their own nests. Outsiders can’t do it. Sorry, I still don’t understand. I need an explanation from Travis why he would advertise on a cop website where it claims that he has promised his support. Is he around??? Once he comments we can put it to bed. But I think the citizens who are concerned about Kelly Thomas, et al, deserve an explantion. That’s not asking too much.
You are assuming that the slate mailer has ANYTHING to do with real cops. It’s a slate mailer for crissakes, get that through your thick skull.
Whaddya think we are? Stupid? The website is called Cops Voter Guide. Why would they call it that? Because it is a voters guide for Fransican nuns? Cut it out. Election season is the time to vet candidates. I think Travis owes the citizens an explanation. Why is that asking too much? Are you Travis’ campaign manager? Again, no dog in this race. Only a concerned citizen. Please stop trying to run cover.
Political mailers are a lucrative business. I would never assume that a mailer that claims to be for COPS actually represents COPS, but has assumed an authority claiming to represent COPS to collect cash for inclusion on mailers.
The wisdom of Travis playing this game is another issue.
Pause and meditate on what you have just heard.
Nice pics, Chris. But answer me this: in an election called to repudiate the dishonesty, political opportunism and LYING of a city council and a pD, why in the fuck should anyone take Travis, Barry and the other guy (I can’t find my COPS mailer) for INTENTIONALLy PAYING to get their names on an INTENTIONALLY MISLEADING mailer. Just speaking from this corner, the old new boss is the old boss, is fucking bullshit. EVERY vote in this election counts. And for Travis, Barry and the other guy to display such crass political opportunism in an effort to secure votes is such an overtly deceptive manner is reason enough for me to not want to support them. And my name is JOEL BEERS, by the way.
JOEL BEERS of the OC Weekly? Sad that you can’t you see the irony in the COPS slate mailer. For God sakes COPS endorsing the “recall”. You’re kidding right?
And COPS’ website that lists Travis running for Orange city council isn’t just funny and a “oh, how humorous oversight.” It’s emblematic of the sad reality that COPS cares about one thing: money. And the people who PAY to be on that mailer? All the fucking care about is scrounging around for a vote or two and, what the fuck, why not purposely mislead people in the process? Fuck that shit.
Wow. A bit deranged, aren’t we? Have a drink and relay. You’ll feel differently tomorrow.
jeez larry, take it down a notch.
I love Fullerton. I love you.
Kelly Thomas did not die to get political opportunists and fucking liars on the Fullerton City Council. No way in hell, do I want the three blind fucking retarded mice to hold onto their seats, but I don’t want younger, fresher-looking equally lying, hypocritical bullshit-fucking-artists to replace them Shame on you, mother fuckers.
Amen! I was preaching this same mantra a few days ago. It’s the same nonsense just different faces. When there are no game plans in place just open-ended promises makes this an equation for destruction. Using children as a fluff piece and selling tool is no longer a way to win votes this day and age.
People love kids. What’s wrong with you. Finish that cocktail and have another. Then pour one for La Roo!
Kelly didn’t die to accomplish anything. Pour yourself a stiff drink and take a deep breath.
What interesting to me is that yesterday, moments after I got the COPS mailer in my mail box, I posited the question, to Travis, about how much it cost to associate his name with such an intentionally misleading mailer. Nothing then and, 28 hours later, nothing now. But we do get a heartwarming post about Travis’ children courtesy of Chris Thompson. So, with no information coming, I can only ASSUme, that Travis is hunkered down with whatever people serve as his political advisors, trying to come up with the “proper” response for such an overtly brazen political stunt. OR, he is just going to choose to ignore all of it. And for someone running for a seat on the council to replace council members who IGNORED something for so long, that seems to make a truly sad poetic sense.
See comment above. Pour yourself another drink.
Hahaha!!! I can just picture the high level committee hunkered down in their crisis center:
“How we gonna answer this BEERS character’s question??!?!?!?!!”
“I don’t know, but if this get’s out something bad will happen, maybe…!?!?!?!?!!!!!!?!!!” *wringing of hands, gnashing of teeth, wetting of pants*
No.
BEERS?
Have a couple, chief.
oh, really? Kelly Thomas didn’t get murdered to make a statement. Wow, mr. Literal, thanks for being such a fucking wizened sage. Jesus. Step out of your anomymity and into the light. Oh, that’s right, like so many of the crowers you can’t stand behind your words. Fuck-nut.
Anonymity? Who the hell are you brave man calling himself Mr. Boo? Come out from behind your bottle and man up!!
BTW, what have you ever done for the recall besides post anonymous comments on a blog?
Or do you really think that the truth you espouse is so DANGEROUS and ILLICIT and HONEST that if you dared provide your real name you’d be hounded, harassed and fucked with? Bullshit. You’re a pussy drone.
Now you’re just talking to the walls in your room.
Calling the kettle black, eh? This is a valid concern and passing this off as nothing is juvenile. Using children to promote a possible seat on our city council is unacceptable and does not cut it. Accept it and move on.
And i’m a bomb-ass bartender. Along with a bomb-ass writer and a bomb-ass teacher. And i offered my real name “calm down.” That means I’m a bomb-ass real person. And you’re a fucking chump who violates the two cardinal rules of Jim Rome’s jungle: you have no take and you suck. So go fuck yourself.
Whoa there, Sam Malone. Quit nipping at the stock and take a deep breath. You sound like a maniac.
A “bomb-ass writer.” I absolutely love it. I’m going to use that!
But who is Jim Rome and what does he do?
Cointelpro
Funny how one paid ad pissed off a bunch of GED cops! Oh the smell of RECALL!
Bye bye FPD!
For the record, I’m college educated and no way related to law enforcement in any aspect. My family has been in this town for over 3 generations. My concern is this fluff and a possible endorsement of law enforcement.
You should be concerned. Go ask Albert Rincon or Jay Cicinelli how they feel about Kiger. Don’t forget to duck.
It’s a slate mailer for God’s sake. The police and their unions have nothing to do with it. And anyhow what’s the disconnect (except in your mind and Mr. Boo’s and Andrew Goodriches’) of being pro-reform and pro-public safety?
The Recall will be good for the FPD, as will a new council made of of dedicated reformers.
The COPS slate contains no lies, no misinformation and no contradictions. As Curious points out – it is ironic but much more importantly buying up slates is good politics. I’m surprised you can’t grasp that. Well, I guess I’m not surprised.
It’s very misleading and what they (Kiger, Levinson and Sebourn) are supposedly against. Just a way to deceive someone else.
Not only is it misleading…citizens have asked this candidate serious questions about his plans of action and he hasn’t responded to any of them. I’m having deja vu from last summer. It’s very ironic; these are the same reasons for the recall in the first place.
If anyone can manipulate typical law and order voters into supporting Travis and the recall, more power to them. The big picture is that the Fullerton PD needs dramatic reforms, and that will benefit all of our public safety.
“DECEPTION IS TRUTH,” in other words? Orwell left that one out of 1984.
At first glance it smacks of playing both sides against the middle. That’s why I asked Travis for an explanation. I want to know his motivation of advertising on a pro-law enforcement site. If I were voting it could possibly cost him my vote without a rational explanation. FPD is not deserving of his support until they clean house. And that is FPD’s responsibility – the the responsibility of the council members or the citizens. FPD must make the first move. But supporting them after what they’ve done to the citizens is unconsciousable.
JustUs.
You are talking about the present. These politicians are looking to the future and police support and confidence is a must for them. If they think like you then they hope to make proper changes and support their PD 100% right?
CUZ HE DONT CARE!!!
So Big Picture is it ok to mislead people to reach the end result of recalling the 3? Doesn’t seem right to me.
It certainly serves the greater good. Is it ok for police unions to mislead law and order voters into thinking that our current policing actually serves the public interest, when it clearly doesn’t?
It doesn’t BP? Crime is at the lowest levels in years (for now, in a year it will be at the highest due to no prison time anymore). Or are you just referring to the pay and retirement that was affordable for years but now with the collapse it’s no longer affordable? If so, that’s the big question no one has an answer too. Employees are never going to take a 50% pay cut in any profession.
There are many things that happen inside the D.A.’s Office that don’t seem right and yet when was the last time the DA charged one of their own?
Why haven’t you spoken up about the games played in your office, or is it ok so long as its one of your own?
Travis is no dummy. He knows that the old farts who vote will support anyone with a mention of police or public safety. Supporting police or public safety is not a death wish in Fullerton. It will still win this election just like it does most elections in other places. Just like the name of this blog says and the speaker said Tuesday night, this city needs to come together and look to the future or it will never succeed.
I couldn’t disagree more. That’s why our political system is rotten to the core. Because politicians betray their own convictions to flow with the power. If they do it when they run for office – what will they do after they are elected. I think it is a failed strategy. It would lose my vote. That’s for sure.
And I think you are wrong with regard to ‘coming together’ as well. There is no indication that FPD is any different today than it was prior to Kelly getting beaten to death. They continue to circle the wagon for their own. They continue to protect one another while dismissing what is best for the citizens. Why would anyone in their right minds ‘come together’ with that? It’s time for FPD to come clean and admit to their wrongdoings. And that message should start at the very top with Chief Hughes. Have you heard any such admission, much less an apology to the citizens whom they’ve harmed? Have you??? Why would you embrace that in a hand-holding ‘come together’ orgy with FPD??? Or is all this just about politics without cleaning up the mess that still saturates city hall???
The mailer has nothing to do with FPD. Travis has made his position on FPD clear. He wants reform. The COPS mailer is an independent group not in any way affiliated with local police. Travis is the FPD’s worst nightmare.
Why can’t we get an official reason for the mailer from Travis. It might make perfect sense and put this whole topic to bed. Aren’t the citizens entitled to know his reason for his advertisement on a pro-cop mailer? We are all for transparency, right? If fact, we are starving for it, right? Then why can’t we get it from a candidate who claims to be a transparency proponent? All we want is a simple answer – NOT FROM YOU – from him. Thanks.
Yes, Travis would be wise to broadcast his campaign strategy to everybody for the sake of “transparency.”
Seriously, “citizens” have no entitlement to campaign strategy transparency. That is really ludicrous.
Harpoon – are you a cop??? You sure sound like one. Your answer could be taken straight from the FPD playbook! Seriously! 😀
No I am not a cop. Just somebody who wants to see Fullerton liberated from the thrall of the police union. You should be too; and you should understand that slate mailers are paid advertising and quit your complaining.
If this is a precursor for what is yet to come – count me out. All he has to do is give reason for his actions. And as it stands now…he can’t use the excuse of the city attorney told me not to say anything.
He doesn’t have to give a reason for anything. If you don’t like it vote for somebody else.
I will take your advice Fred. And if Travis is reading this, he has lost my vote because of the lack of response on his end and not to mention the overabundant amount of disrespectful responses from his supporters.
Sounds like something Danny Goodrich might say.
Kiger will win. Period.
Right now the FPOA is gearing up to spend a pile of money to keep him out. It will backfire making the FPD look even worse.
Yep I’d say so. And I think Matt Rowe would back that too.
FPD is running scared and there is no question about that. They should be in light of all that has happened.
But wait! More bad apples dropping near you soon!!!
Someone wrote this: “If anyone can manipulate typical law and order voters into supporting Travis and the recall, more power to them. The big picture is that the Fullerton PD needs dramatic reforms, and that will benefit all of our public safety.”
More power to someone who wants to manipulate voters? Whatever. And I thought the big picture is to return some sort of trust in our local government through HONESTY, OPENNESS and TRANSPARENCY, not through intentionally misleading voters.
Wow, you sure have a low opinion of the intelligence of the voters. Are you some sort of intellectual elitist?
It speaks for the motives of the people who intentionallymislead than it is of the voters, Fred. How is this COPS b.s. any different from bankhead and others claiming to be Democrats on one of their mailers in 2010? It really isn’t. That’s the point.
and low opinion of FULLERTON FUCKING VOTERS? Are you high, dude? Who has voted Jones and Bankhead into office since the Stones Ages? geez. man, that’s the funniest thing I’ve read today.
If Fullerton voters are dumb, then why not manipulate them into voting for reformers for the greater good? Your argument isn’t logically consistent. You are basically saying: be honest and let the dumb voters vote no on the recall so we can keep Jones, Bankhead and McKinley.
You’re arguing logically. Stop it.
What you’re advocating is called fascism. The Nazis used the same rationale to manipulate the public for what they perceived as the greater good.
**Note, I’m not calling anyone a fascist. I’m just saying this train of thought is incredibly harmful, stupid, and wrong. Knock it off Big Picture.**
Here’s an analogy. Candidate X is a civil rights supporter running a campaign in an area full of white supremacists. He signs on to a commercial mailer called KLAN and his statement says, “by supporting racial equality I will guarantee equal and fair treatment of all, including white people.” Ignorant white supremacists presume Candidate X is thus a white supremacist supporter like them and are manipulated into voting for him. He wins, and the REAL white supremacist candidate loses.
Fair or foul? Fascism or poetic justice? You make the call.
False duality.
Nazi Germany: Nazis are rounding up Jews to send them to concentration camps. A Nazi posts a sign that says: Freedom for Jews this way! The sign actually leads to a gas chamber.
Fair or foul? Fascism or poetic justice? You make the call.
You’re pushing well beyond the boundaries of a simple logical fallacy. If you want to post some more nonsense under the guise of moral relativism, then you’re closer to those 6 cops than you are to the rest of us.
I don’t know what the rationale for the mailers in question are; however, I can tell you what you’re posting is wrong. Stop it.
I’m actually advocating utilitarianism, not moral relativism.
“Descriptive moral relativism holds only that some people do in fact disagree about what is moral; meta-ethical moral relativism holds that in such disagreements, nobody is objectively right or wrong; and normative moral relativism holds that because nobody is right or wrong, we ought to tolerate the behavior of others even when we disagree about the morality of it.” http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_relativism
I’m saying that misleading voters who are in my example racist, or in the actual case here uncritical police supporters is a lesser moral evil than those voters being able to elect, in my example, a racist, or in reality, a police supporter.
Your example doesn’t work because clearly concentration camps are a larger moral evil than lying. If you flipped your example around and it was Jews pretending to be Nazis and manipulating Nazis into granting Jews freedom than clearly that would be morally right. The principle being that while lying or deceiving people is generally wrong, if it is done in the service of saving lives or some other kind of enormous good than it is not as wrong..
In general though I agree, lying to voters is wrong. I’m not sure this was done intentionally. But even if it was, given the nature of the voters being lied to and the issues at stake it is a lesser moral evil then if the recall didn’t pass.
So its not moral relativism. Its the existence of a moral hierarchy. Or utilitarianism maybe.
Did you seriously just throw a wikipedia article at me?
. . .
I’m going to take you at face value and appreciate that you agree that lying to voters is wrong. That’ll be the end of it.
No, I pasted a small section of a wikipedia article and a link to it into my response to illustrate that nothing I was saying could be construed as moral relativism. I hope my use of wikipedia didn’t offend your sense of intellectual superiority in any way.
Lying to (particularly stupid) voters is wrong but a lesser evil than if the recall fails. Just what I’ve been saying all along.
Oh, and did you just lose an argument and then say “that’ll be the end of it?” OK by me.
Hey, asshat. Don’t be rude.
You’d know it if I was being rude. But I’m in a good mood so I’ll ignore your use of “asshat.” Blowhard.
You’re misapplying a utilitarian logic to a relativistic world view. I know you don’t agree with that, which is why I tried to find common ground and move on.
Stating I have a sense of intellectual superiority is being rude. Telling me I lost an argument that never actually existed is also rude. This is a blog. Neither one of us is going to convince the other about who’s right about a philosophical argument that’s 400 years old.
If you don’t want to leave it at the common ground I identified, fine. If you don’t think that asshat is the functional equivalent of your rudeness, also fine.
If it’s all the same to you, I’d much rather get back to making fun of John Doe and let Harpoon direct his or her comments to folks more deserving.
Hey, dipshit, where is the lie?
What is this, random insult day? I’ve been backing Travis on this the whole thread long, numbnuts.
Oh that was to For the record, wasn’t it. Sorry, my bad. Carry on Harpoon!
I didn’t say anyone was lying.
“If Fullerton voters are dumb, then why not manipulate them into voting for reformers for the greater good?” If that “greater good” is predicated on misinformation and deception and manipulation, than you can keep your greater good. I’ll take the truth any day over some subjective opining on “the greater good.” Although I agree the “greatest good” is all this is those three blind guys are recalled.I just want to make sure that the people I vote for are leaders, and not opportunists willing to spin the truth any way possible to get elected.
mr. boo hoo to you
Where is the misinformation? Where is the deception? Where is the manipulation? You cooked up your own outrage after letting a bunch of your own assumptions simmer.
Come to think of it I don’t believe you let anything simmer. I think you just popped off and are too embarrassed to let it go.
Then maybe its not subjective opining. Maybe its an objective truth, and the end (greatest good) justifies the means (confusing a few law and order voting boobs).
“Well, when the president does it that means that it is not illegal.” That was AFTER he was president. 30 years prior, after winning his first election to the House of Representatives: “All that matters is winning.” You connect the dots on that slippery slope, Big Picture…
I do see your point Mr. boo. I’m just not as much of an absolutist on this issue as you seem to be. If Travis was running for something more powerful than city council and his agenda went far beyond reforming the police department I might even be concerned too. But he isn’t, and it isn’t, and I’m not.
That is exactly what the Jews thought about Hitler before he released his soldiers out for genocide.
No. It is absolutely not. If Travis was a racist or anti-Semite I’d be the first to renounce him. If the worst thing he has ever done is misrepresent himself as being more pro-police than he really is, and even that is debatable, and he did that in the service of ending police brutality, this is not exactly equivalent to Nazism. Come on.
The last part of your comment was what I referring to. And how are you so sure on his intentions? Lying is lying…there is no grey area in this one. It’s amazing how the forest isn’t being seen for the trees. And to your it’s not Nazism – do your research. Misleading the public for your own political gain by propaganda for the “greater good” and public safety is the mode of mind control Hitler succeeded in.
“Misleading the public for your own political gain by propaganda” is what every politician in the Republican and Democratic parties do every day, all day. You don’t have to invoke Godwin’s law if that is your only point. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Godwin%27s_law
The public safety thing is ironic. He’s not going to help public safety by more laws and policing, but by having less.
So you agree with misleading the public for political gains is an appropriate action? And you do realize wikipedia is like the Gloria Allred of information? Once again, what makes you so sure of his intentions? Because he has yet to clarify ANYTHING.
1. I’m not sure its misleading
2. Yes, I’m ok with misleading the stupidest voters in America if its just because they’re too stupid to check even the simplest facts, and if its serves a greater purpose, like protecting us from out of control cops.
3. Wikipedia is actually a reasonable source of information. Its not perfect, but its not as bad as its detractors claim.
4. Who is Gloria Allred and why should I care? Oh, I guess I should look her up on Wikipedia. But that would be self-referential since apparently Wikipedia is her. I’m entering the interdimensional wormhole aren’t I…
5. Its been clarified to me. Why don’t you ask him? info@fullertonsfuture.org.
I don’t want to poke the bear, but seriously– stop dropping Wikipedia pages.
It’d be like me whipping out a dictionary and pointing to a page while having a discussion with you. No one does that.
You can start from some standard of “objective truth,” but every little fragment chipped off that idealized statue devalutes that notion and, all too often, seems to render it a tool to be used by people as opposed to a standard to uphold.
Yeah, but we all agree that Kelly Thomas shouldn’t have been murdered by the police. So whether you want to call that an objective moral truth or a universal moral truth or a collective subjection opinion or whatever, it still stands. We are all united in that belief, against the police who believe otherwise.
On the mailer, either the end justify the means or it doesn’t. Reasonable people can disagree about that. I’m making the case that it does.
Oh brother. You sure are self-righteous.
I hope we do not see any more of these from Traivs or Levinson. They are not my first choice but I still be lieve that if either one of them win it will be an inprovement compared to what we have now. You will not see any deceptive adds like this one or otherwise, from Jane Rands, Matt Rowe or Glenn Georgieff. I have asked them.
The mailer is disingenuous at best. It makes it seem like there is an organized group of people out there who in some way are associated with the Police, and that this group has vetted all the candidates based on their public service record, and pro law enforcement policies, and that they have now endorsed Travis, Levinson and that Seabourn with a voter guide for all of their members. Unless I’m told otherwise by Tony, who I trust will tell me the truth, anyone who paid the fee to have their candidacy attached to the mailer got to do so without both of the following two things. 1. a review of their policies and public record on matters of public safety and 2.a comparison to the other candidates who did not attempt to be added. These are what is required to be endorsed rather than be on fake endorsemetn add. Cops, families of Cops and Friends of Cops, are in mass upset (as they should be) at Travis for the great work FFFF has done to push for reform and to get justice for Kelly Thomas. Things like this are a step backwards. They are an attempt by Travis and the others, to shave a few voters over to their camp from people who would not vote for them if they knew the whole picture. Unfortunately there is not one substantial Law Enforcement PAC or Lobby that will like his views on public unions or the high pensions cops look forward to. (I do like his views on those things) A group of “pro-cop” advocates are not likely to endorse Travis. Instead of wearing that as a badge of honor, he did what the hacks before him have done – he was less than truthful.
I look forward to the day when bulllsh*t political moves like this from either side of the political fence, translates to less votes, not more, for it will mean that we have truly changed the system. I am supporting Glenn Georgieff, in this race, and Glenn has not signed on to anything like this. Neither have Matt Rowe or Jane Rands, who also get my vote and the votes of many of my friends.
To my mind Travis is an improvement over the village idiot now under threat of recall, but I am saddened that any recall candidate would use the same tired faux voter guides that Jones and Bankhead have used throughout their tenure. I, and others, who have been part of the recall and J4K movements are aiming for more than “just better than Jones”. Let’s all of us, me included, call out the candidates, even if we support them, when they do things that are intended to take advantage of uninformed voters rather than gain support by informing the voter and stating their reasons for taking a position. Democracy deserves better than thisand most importantly, Fullerton deserves better than this.
If you find this post offensive and now choose to slam me or those who I support, your motives in this recall are not pure, and you are not worthy of my time. The three candidates I am supporting do not hold common views on many important matters, with each other, or with me, but they do have the same character. In this recall election, one which is held in the shadow of a murder and cover-up, character matters more than ideology because Fullerton cannot get out of the shadow of corruption, if we can not trust those who will lead us to tell us the full truth. With character they will find common ground and compromise and Fullerton will benefit greatly.
-bax
(I am not a member of any election commitee for any of the above, and I do not speak for any of the candidates which I support)
Baxter The Great, Mind reader Extraordinaire!
You are generally right, but the way people are acting it’s like Travis just fried up some babies and ate them for lunch. I could understand a very tiny modicum of moral outrage, but not the fullblown tantrum. However I will just charitably attribute that to drunkeness and hangovers.
All Travis has to do is give a good reason why and this whole issue goes bye-bye. It’s a very easy solution.
If I were running as an anti-union candidate and my name popped up on a pro-union brochure asking for support that would deserve an explanation.
LACK OF TRANSPARENCY is what got Fullerton in trouble.
You want more of the same???
Are you folks truly interested in improving the city government or is this just all about politics and electing friends and buddies?
Saying that he does not owe us an explanation is the same as saying he does not have to be transparent in his quest for a council seat.
Of course he doesn’t owe you anything. And you don’t owe him anything. Can’t you clowns get this through your thick skulls? If you don’t trust Travis vote for the other guy.
You act like your boyfriend needs to explain his whereabouts to you.
Wow…just wow. I’m sure you felt differently last summer when we weren’t getting answers from our current council, right? How is this any different?
Nice that someone can go out of their way and post a long, measured response and is dismissed in such a pithy fashion. Come on people. As much as you might want to think so, not everyone who disagrees with the party-line at this site wants to raze Fullerton to the ground or likes the smell of bacon. (Even I, as foul-mouthed and maniacal as i sounded–i only swore to get some attention, i’m needy, so sue me) don’t hate Fullerton). But I’m also not ready to jump on any bandwagon. I have nothing but respect for Travis and what he’s helped to accomplish on FFF. But that doesn’t mean I can’t question his inclusion on an intentionally disleading mailer.
BAXTER FOR PRESIDENT!!!!!!!!
Here’s a thought… Maybe the use of the slate was preemptive in keeping RINOs and DINOs like Alvarez, Birsic, and Chaffee from using them. Just sayin’
not a bad point anonymous. I’ve seen this “cops voter guide” before.And if they are just a company that goes to the first bidder, it’s an interesting claim.
First bidder. No question.
I do not support politicians misrepresenting themselves to rope in all the ignorant voters (although that is a pretty big block).
But ask Mr. Boo what he thinks of this brochure:
http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/05/17/Obama-pamphlet-in-use-2007
Born in Kenya. Probably.
And what happened to Breitbart? What happened to the coroner that did Breitbart’s autopsy? And you are all concerned over some 2 bit mailer?
Hmmm. Do I know you? Anyway, what’s the 400-year old source of this argument out of curiosity?
I’m fine with dropping this too. Plenty more targets deserving of ridicule.
Relativism, what it means, and how it’s applied is a very old story.
On to better targets and ensuring proper use of YOR on this board . . .
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yor,_the_Hunter_from_the_Future ??
ok, well done.
Wow, this blog was about kids of some of the cadidates. Somewhere, it took a bbbiiiiiggggg left turn.
Big Picture – Awesome how you made your comment unavailable for me to reply to it. Must be the powers at be to have the opportunity to do that. Which makes me question your motive.
YOUR MOST REVEALING ANSWERS OF YOUR EGO:
1. I’m not sure its misleading
2. Yes, I’m ok with misleading the stupidest voters in America if its just because they’re too stupid to check even the simplest facts, and if its serves a greater purpose, like protecting us from out of control cops.
1. How is lying to the public not misleading? By semantics and amount of syllables?
2. And I cannot believe you referred to your fellow American citizens as too stupid to fact check. How about politicians not lie and mislead citizens? What if these “stupid” voters don’t have the ways and means to fact check…your response is basically “fuck them”
This is what is wrong with society – no compassion and ZERO EMPATHY for your fellow man.
Amazing…simply amazing. I hope Travis is taking mental notes on how his supporters are making him look by their disheartening comments. Because in the end, the old saying of: “you are who you hang around” sticks out like a sore thumb.
At a certain point in the thread you can no longer just hit reply. Its not my doing.
I don’t think Travis lied to the public. Period. He paid for an ad from an organization that puts out mailers which makes it look like the police support certain candidates. That is misleading of that company. I agree. I don’t think its a big deal. I don’t think the average voter is stupid but I do think of law and order voters being a bit on the simple side. Especially in a place like Fullerton. What kind of person would watch the Kelly Thomas video and still vote kneejerk law and order, support your local police? Can you understand why even though I might be empathetic to that person in all of their godawful brainwashed stupidity, I still think a higher good might be that we don’t have rogue officers out beating people half to death, or to death, as the case may be?
I have a lot of compassion. I don’t want anyone else being beaten to death in my town. Or falsely arrested. Or having their fingers broken for fun. BIG PICTURE. Do you understand?
I agree politicians should not lie. Who wouldn’t? But they do. This isn’t about honor at this point, its about preventing our public servants from brutalizing our citizens.
Travis may not even want my support. Its not about him anyway. Its about cleaning up the damn police department. That is more important than a mailer. Please tell me now for the love of god that you finally understand.
First impressions last a life time. Remember that the next time you choose to take crass behavior and try to validate it with the symptoms of MPD. Research to understand the psyches of all mankind. It’s time to deprogram.
Let’s trick people into voting for Travis, Greg and Barry because it’s oK. Classy
Well said Baxter. Rowe, Rands and Georgieff
Travis Kiger’s little girl? Well Well… Is this the same Travis Kiger that made phone calls in the middle of the night to police officers’ homes and awakend their little girls? Travis do peole really know who and what you are? Oh yes, there is proof of the phone calls.
Prove it.